Holy Hygge (Part 1)

I’ll bet you’ve already heard of hygge. Actually, I’m willing to make the bet more interesting by putting 100 kroner on the fact that you’ve been told that it’s a good thing. That hygge is a curled-up-on-the-sofa-in-November-with-dimmed-lights-a-good-movie-popcorn-and-a-dearly-beloved-under-the-rug kinda thing.

I’m afraid you’ve been lied to.

There’s nothing likeable about hygge at all. Except if you like keeping your air intake at the absolute minimum level required to keep your vital organs working or otherwise celebrate conditions where externally imposed stimuli are completely absent. Nevertheless hygge is not only a state of mind that Danes escape to now and then to catch their breaths in the humdrum of modern life. It’s the mother of all downsides of Denmark, so to fully understand our unfortunate national character, we need to scrutinise the phenomenon intensely. Hence the two-piece split-up of this post.

Let’s start with pronunciation, which implicates the ability to master the Danish way of dealing with both the Y-vowel and the sound of the double consonant GG.

If English is your native tongue, you’re in trouble with the Danish Y. There simply are no words in your language that encompass this sound. The best thing you can do is to purse your lips as if you were going to say “OH” but make the sound of “EE” instead. The GG’s are easier – you can find help in “bragging” or “gagging”.

If you’re German, it’s ein Klacks für dich. Think of “Ü” and you’re there. GG shouldn’t cause trouble either.

Now French. Think of your word for “naked” – “nu” – and you’ve got it. The GGs could be a challenge for you, but try doubling the first G-sound in “demagog”. (I’m aware of your… special needs… regarding the H in the beginning. Try letting air pass from your throat and out of your mouth without adding any sound. Like a sigh of despair.)

For the Spanish readers it’s easier to explain what not to do: Don’t use the sound of Y in your ‘word’ for “and” – “y” – and don’t just double the G-sound from “gringo” because it would just mess you up.

If you speak Mandarin you could practise your Ys by calling out for your friend Yu. Regarding the GGs – I’m afraid I have no idea… Perhaps my friend Liyuan can be of assistance.

Now let’s move on to the actual meaning of the word hygge. The problem is that it’s possible to find words in almost every other language that’s approximately the same as some of the original aspects of the hygge concept. The cosiness that applies to locations in English speaking countries. The Gemütlichkeit that can develop among Germans. Or the douillet in French cafés. All of them describing a certain feeling of happiness, individually or in groups, deriving from feeling safe and shielded from circumstances or people that could inflict harm. But none of them come anywhere near what hygge has disintegrated into in Denmark.

We adopted the word from Norway, probably because Norway was Denmark once. But as with so many other aspects of life, all the different and interesting nuances of the concept that thrive in Norwegian culture have been eroded by the general Danish brutishness. So all that’s left now is one single characteristic: recognisability. And that brings us to the heart of the matter.

Hygge in Denmark is the condition of complete absence of anything we haven’t seen before. Because new things have the mere possibility of imposing danger. You can find proof of that in how we use its antonym, uhygge. That means ‘scary’ in Danish. We use it to characterise scary movies or the perspectives of war. Perhaps this circumstance makes the meaning of hygge clearest to all you lucky non-Danes out there. I’ll bet another 100 kroner on the fact that you wouldn’t find ‘not cosy’ a fulfilling description of what’s going on in Alfred Hitchcock’s ‘Psycho’ or life in the jungle in Vietnam in the early 1970s.

The perverted philosophy of life that hygge has become offers a variety of paradoxes in Danish culture. I’ll give you a few examples, but  my advice is not to try to understand them, because that would mean that hygge has infected you and hygge is known to be incurable.

1: Equality

On the surface Danish society looks like it has a stream of fairness running through its veins. No one is homeless. No one is filthy rich. Distribution of wealth through high taxation is welcomed with a smile by everyone. The workplace culture is dominated by a sense of consensus, not by tyrannical bosses.

But if you scratch the surface the uhyggelige truth emerges immediately: 5,000 people are homeless. The ten richest families collectively account for a fortune of 320 billion kroner which equates to around 20% of our gross domestic product. 70% of  Danes find moonlighting okay (the number for immigrants is 18% by the way…).

The number of psychopaths in managerial positions is four times higher than in the society as a whole. The number of compensations paid out by insurance companies for personal damages induced by bad managers has risen 50% during the last 3 years.

And if you present these figures to Danes, they’ll either question the validity of the statistics or say that it’s their firm belief that it’s worse in other countries. Why? Because acknowledging the truth would mean that changes should be made. And change compromises hygge.

2: Tolerance

At first glance, Danes seem quite tolerant. They will tell you that they believe that everyone has the right to practise their religion as they please. That gay people can kiss and hold hands in the street, even marry each other if they want to. That everyone is entitled to their quirks and a variety of foibles in the local community only adds charm to the neighbourhood.

Here’s the reality check: In the late 1960s and early 1970s a substantial number of Muslim citizens came to Denmark. It took more than 30 years before they were permitted to be buried outside Christian graveyards. Not a single minaret has been allowed to be built yet and the vast majority of mosques are refurbished cellars or apartments. This week the government decided to give 100,000 kroner to any Danish citizen of ‘non-western origin’ that leaves the country for good.

Gay people can marry – but not in churches. Last week a famous football player published a book (probably written while he was serving a sentence for beating up his ex-wife) in which he states that he “really hates gay people, they are fucking disgusting” and “admires Hell’s Angels for not doubting their masculinity”.

That led a famous actor to yell angrily at him in a TV show they both attended the other day. Not because of the obvious bigotry or sick fascination with violence. But because the book had stirred up a commotion that “completely ruined the hygge!” in Denmark. The head of communications at the Danish Football Association stated that gay men should “pay respect to the majority that could feel unsafe when confronted with viewpoints of minority groups”.

The number of lawsuits between neighbours has risen 300% during the last 5 years.

So you see, there are no limits to what Danes will do to defend the sanctity of hygge by oppressing anything and anyone who dares to be different and deny any truth that challenges them to change things. I think this also explains the extremely high suicide rate in our country compared to the rest of the western world. And I’m not alone in this theory. The brilliant British novelist V. S. Naipaul wrote about it in a letter to his friend Paul Theroux in 1995:

“If you are interested in horrible places, I can recommend Denmark. No one starves. Everyone lives in small, pretty houses. But no one is rich, no one has a chance to a life in luxury, and everyone is depressed. Everyone lives in their small well-organized cells with their Danish furniture and their lovely lamps, without which they would go mad.”

In Holy Hygge (Part 2) I’ll take you through a couple of examples of the fact that Danes are willing to put up with self-mutilation – even death – to defend this relic of the hygge cult.

By Peter Andreas • November 16, 2009
Categories:


45 Comments

42 Comments

  1. Posted November 16, 2009 at 11:00 am by Heidi aka Fuzzy | Permalink

    Well worth the wait, Peter. I suspect your apt description of hygge is bordering on the treasonous to many of your countrymen.

    The V.S. Naipaul quote is GOLD, but the quote I will take away today is this one:

    “And if you present these figures to Danes, they’ll either question the validity of the statistics or say that it’s their firm belief that it’s worse in other countries. Why? Because acknowledging the truth would mean that changes should be made. And change compromises hygge.”

  2. Posted November 16, 2009 at 1:18 pm by BABS | Permalink

    Oh my, this post looks hyggelig! I haven’t read it yet but I am going to pull on a velour loungesuit, light a few candles, and make some intricate origami christmas stars out of small strips of paper while I settle down to read this post in entirety.

  3. Posted November 16, 2009 at 11:39 pm by BABS | Permalink

    I’ve read it now and it was great.

    I want to know, how do you cope in daily life as a Dane who is probably moving in Danish circles? With your viewpoint, do they just gaffer tape you to a chair in the corner and have meetings about what they are gonna do with you?

  4. Posted November 17, 2009 at 12:14 pm by Canadian | Permalink

    Ah… This post does explain a lot. Great insight!

    The paragraph with the quotes from the actor and the Danish Football Association is especially telling.

    “the majority (…) could feel unsafe when confronted with viewpoints of minority groups”.

    Wow!!! There are so many things wrong with this quote, I wouldn’t know where to start. Foreigners, let’s keep challenging those Danes. They desperately need it, whether they realize it or not!

    Thanks, Peter! Only a Dane could have put the finger on this one, and expressed it so well. :-)

  5. Posted November 17, 2009 at 6:51 pm by Ebbe | Permalink

    Let us not forget that only some Danes can be characterised by this post — perhaps even the majority. Nevertheless, we are a large minority that are not like this. It’s like in Italy: Not everybody voted for Berlusconi. Generalisations tend to severely distort the image.

  6. Posted November 18, 2009 at 5:04 pm by kel d | Permalink

    Oh yes, Ebbe, let’s point out that there are exceptions to this!

    I am sure that Peter was completely oblivious to the fact that Not All Danes Are Like That. >.<

    When will the debate move on from how to have the debate?

  7. Posted December 2, 2009 at 12:22 am by rich | Permalink

    But if the rest of the world could just wake up and do it the Danish way – all would be perfect…!!!

  8. Posted December 13, 2009 at 12:19 pm by Michal | Permalink

    “This week the government decided to give 100,000 kroner to any Danish citizen of ‘non-western origin’ that leaves the country for good.”

    Can someone please provide the Danes with Hitler’s phone number.

    I’m sure together they can come up with a better and cheaper alternative than this.

    Something that probably involves Cyanide.

  9. Posted December 21, 2009 at 9:15 pm by Don | Permalink

    Aside from the ignorant “Hitler” comparison, I think the discussion went well.
    Though, I would offer trading one-for-one my place here in the richest, most powerful,proudest, can never do wrong & bestest, country ever to exist on the face of the earth for anyone’s place in Denmark (or Scandinavia in general). One-for-one swap. No net gain or loss. Would the Danish government go for that? I’m an engineer and can contribute to the system for another 30 years or so.
    My counterpart could move to the USA and chase after the “dream” of being a millionaire celebrity (just don’t get sick or injured) and I will be happy living a modest lifestyle riding my bicycle to and from work with healthcare and education for myself and my family. I don’t require much.
    Any takers?
    I’m serious!

  10. Posted December 26, 2009 at 10:15 pm by Canadian | Permalink

    It would be easier to move to Canada, Don. We have free, universal health care, and we speak the same language. ;-)

  11. Posted January 10, 2010 at 5:41 pm by desertSage | Permalink

    Being an American and having the misfortune to having been born poor, I would love to have been born there instead. Perhaps then my beautiful daughters wouldn’t in their mid 30′s be disfigured, with one walking around toothless or the other with a tumor distorting her face. The one had a genius IQ and even though she never had any formal schooling past the 12th grade has supported herself as a legal secretary still she can’t afford insurance. The other has emotional problems and because the only low cost mental facility is 15 miles away and she has no car or money to take the bus to and from, she sits in my basement to depressed to live. I should mention my son who is an electronic technician and has a good paying job with insurance but the insurance wouldn’t pay to have him go to the Mayo Clinic to have sleep studies done to find out why he can’t sleep. He has extreme insomnia. He will be disabled soon. He was an excellent worker for 15 years before the lack of sleep started to break down his physical health. He is now too sick to work but his company depends on him so much they allow him to come in when he can but how long will that go on?

  12. Posted January 13, 2010 at 1:50 am by Nicole | Permalink

    What is Denmark like in regards to race relations? I am an African American woman and I have always wanted to visit Denmark, but I would like for it to be a pleasant experience. Can anyone shed some light on the racial climate there?

  13. Posted January 27, 2010 at 8:47 pm by Crystal | Permalink

    Insightful post.

    I also love kel d’s comment “When will the debate move on from how to have the debate?” I just realized that this is how a lot of meaningful debates are derailed.

    I think hygge-addicted danes should be left to be. They are really content with their “safe” life…they are.

    And yes, it is annoying when they stick their unsympathetic, unempathetic and uninformed noses into other peoples business, but it doesn’t help to try to educate or enlighten them. It only makes them become more ferociously protective of their hygge.

    *sigh*

  14. Posted February 1, 2010 at 9:37 pm by peter amanya | Permalink

    Its important and better that they live independent life without anybody’s interference.when you swallow any object that is the the size of the your throat,then you can never feel any pain.
    Maybe you did not talk about racism.how do they go about??
    when u visit any country be ready to meet challanges in their language.its natural and normal after all Britons occupy most parts of America but when they go back home,their axicent is completely different.

  15. Posted February 6, 2010 at 1:46 pm by Goodbye DK | Permalink

    Thanks for this post. I have left Denmark, disillusioned after living there for years. You put into words exactly what I have instinctively felt but was unable to verbalize. I suppose that is due to a misunderstanding of the word “hygge” on my part. I will forward this to all my foreign friends in Denmark. I think it will be of some comfort to them to know that they are not insane for feeling “hygge” is not their friend. Again, thanks. To hear it from a Dane is a great relief, seriously.

  16. Posted February 12, 2010 at 5:59 pm by Heidi | Permalink

    Nicole, it’s a mixed bag, I am told. As long as you let Danes know off the bat that you’re American, you probably will be okay. Somalis fare much much much worse in this society.

    I suspect that most Danish people will be perfectly pleasant to you, but I suppose in the end it will be up to you what you can tolerate of their famous ironic humor and free speech (v. important in Denmark as long as they’re the ones doing the insulting). Just be prepared to encounter blackface at parties and perhaps hear liberal use of the N word in supposed polite company!

  17. Posted February 12, 2010 at 6:04 pm by Heidi | Permalink

    Peter, Peter, where have you gone? You are missed.

    This brilliant Mr. Manky post reminded me somewhat of things said here.

    Hope you’re well.

  18. Posted February 19, 2010 at 10:25 pm by Tom Rominger | Permalink

    I really enjoyed your blogg. I have been married to a beautiful Danish woman for over 20 years and she has never explained Hygge to me. I’ve seen this cultural mannerism displayed many times and just thought danes were odd, hardheaded, or ego-trippin’. Rock on!

  19. Posted February 24, 2010 at 12:42 am by Madsen | Permalink

    @Heidi

    Manky exercises censorship in his comments sections…disagree with him and your comments wont be approved.

  20. Posted February 25, 2010 at 11:39 am by michael | Permalink

    Denmark as he does (although not as extreme).

    In Denmark we do very little (self-) censorship on both ourselves and on political parties. Combined with a sarcastic humor that is difficult to understand for some non-western foreigners, this can create a bad first introduction for some. Also, I think, people like Fuzzy, Manky and Andreas are highly influenced by what they see in the media (they hear a minority of politicians speak islamophobic and concludes that all Danes are evil bigots) as well as their own self-sustained bigoted and isolated social groups. They have created a picture of evil in their head and no sanity or facts can remove it. They cling to the experiences that validates their view and ignores the rest.

    Here is a quote from one of my comments
    “Let me repeat myself: If foreign non-western people with a Danish education has similar employee and pay statistics as native Danes, then it is unlikely that (general) discrimination occurs during the hiring process. If actual discrimination was anything else than perceived it would have a huge impact on these statistics. Also, why would xenophobic employers hire these ‘lesser’ races, give them the same wages and then discriminate them on a daily basis?”

    Regardless of the accusations of the few, several studies of the Northern European mindset shows that Danes are very similar to Swedes, Norwegians and Icelanders in that we generally welcome other people. Some of our immigration policies are stricter, but this does not equal racism. There was some problems with forced muslim marriages and too much ghetto creation (like in other european countries) and this needed to be treated politically instead of censured.

  21. Posted February 25, 2010 at 12:05 pm by michael | Permalink

    Most of Andreas accussations are products of his own imagination, but let me take up a few of his claims:

    a) “Not a single minaret has been allowed to be built yet and the vast majority of mosques are refurbished cellars or apartments.”

    There is a difference between “allowing” something and that no muslim organization or individuals has chosen to fund a minaret. It’s perfectly legal to build your own religious buildings – just don’t expect the taxpayers to fund it.

    b) “This week the government decided to give 100,000 kroner to any Danish citizen of ‘non-western origin’ that leaves the country for good.”

    To get the money a few conditions need to be met. For instance, you must be a CRIMINAL, unwilling to support yourself financially and generally HATE our society and call our women whores if they go without a scarf. I think it’s a win/win if we offer these losers some money to get the hell out. After all, it’s still completely voluntary …unfortunately.

    c) “I think this also explains the extremely high suicide rate in our country compared to the rest of the western world. And I’m not alone in this theory.”

    This is an important subject, so I naturally have to validate your claim. Normally I trust people, but I have experience with other bigots trying to make up ‘facts’, which a) also is a clear example of. Here’s the actual numbers:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_suicide_rate

    By the way. Another fact is, that Denmark are year after year being rated as “the most happy place to live in” by scientist who study within the subject.

    d) You make a lot of “drama”-examples and tries to deduct a general tendency from them. Come on, I can find the exact same examples or worse in any country. It proves exactly as much as your faked facts.

    e) …na, I think you’ve had enough for now.

    Btw: “hygge” means “to relax and have a nice time”. Nothing more, and nothing less.

    What really wonders me are why…? Why on earth do Peter Andreas and Mr Manky dedicate so much of their spare time on hatred to the country they have chosen to spend their lives in? Is it really so important to be a judgmental bigot, who accuses everybody else of being a judgmental bigot?

  22. Posted February 25, 2010 at 2:38 pm by Thomas Cook | Permalink

    How cute – a bunch of wankers that gather round the fireside hating on a nation. Your lives must be quite empty.

    If you hate a country so much … Feel free to fucking get the hell out!

  23. Posted February 25, 2010 at 4:07 pm by Peter Andreas | Permalink

    @michael:

    A) You’re wrong. Every building requires a planning permission and a public hearing process.

    B) The 100,000 kroner reward doesn’t apply to a criminal Denmark-hater from, let’s say, America or Spain. Only ‘non-western’ criminal Denmark-haters are eligible. That’s ethnic cleansing. More about that in a later post.

    C) That link was the original source of my argument. Isn’t it striking that ‘the happiest people on earth‘ is far, far away from having the lowest suicide rate in the world?

    D) That’s a very common argument among Danes when you confront them with any downside of Denmark. Does that mean that we shouldn’t correct ourselves before we are the worst country in the world?

    E) No please, carry on. I’m still standing.

    Regarding your personal definition of hygge – if you have the guts to let it be challenged I can recommend science: http://www.sdu.dk/staff/jtr.aspx

  24. Posted February 25, 2010 at 6:03 pm by michael | Permalink

    @peter andreas

    A) Of course there are regulations to be followed like with any other building of significant size, including ordinary shops. However, the problem with the lack of minarettes seems to be more related to funding and noise polution than discrimatory legal stuff.

    B) In my opinion the money offer should cover assholes from all countries. However, the problem is not that non-westerners are treated unfairly, it is the opposite. They are given a proposition, that they can either voluntarily accept or deny. Non-danish westerners do not have this right. This could seem like the very unfair, but I think it should be seen in a different light. The background of the law, is that a lot of the criminal fugitives from Afrika and the middle east lie about their own persecution. We cannot necessarily know the fakers from the real victims and thus a monetary offer makes quite a lot sense. Proven non-persecuted serious criminals should not have this offer. They should just be sent back regardless of original nationality. Since persecution isn’t likely in western countries this law automatically targets non-westerners.

    I do not now the actual use of the money offer and forced exclusion, so I would not say that it is without problems. However, fact is, non-westerners are given an offer and they are free to accept or deny it. They have an opportunity that others does not have.

    C) You go from saying we have extremely high suicide rates to saying we are far from the lowest. Please notice how much higher Sweden is, even though they have much more open borders to immigrants and have an extreme amount of (self-) censorship in their media and among politicians.

    D) If you think singular examples should be used to generalize a whole country then you have the same rationalization-skills of a priest from the danish peoples parti. And no, this doesn’t mean that we shouldn’t deal with the problems.

    E) standing …and in denial. Better not make it more complicated then.

    PS: The rantings of a single phd-student’s pseudo-scientific wordplay doesn’t quite do it for me. Please give me specific data for how ‘hygge’ is related to our ‘bigotry’. It should be simple: just ask a lot of different Danes if they could have ‘hygge’ in a foreign non-western country or with a muslim that they have just met. You would probably find that most Danes would say ‘yes’. Even some from DF would do it. But it wouldn’t support your claim so better not waste the time.

    Sorry about the pre-defined behavior, but I have some experience with the reactions of bigots from all of the political spectre. At first they always try to argue, but when I constantly prove their data to be wrong og logic to be flawed, the tend to become aggressive and completely incapable to even the simplest form of reflection. I think it’s the reptile brain that works when they’re cornered. And then again, by accusing Denmark of being bigots, you are also accusing me. So it’s only fair if I return the favor – especially since I can support my claim.

  25. Posted February 25, 2010 at 6:31 pm by michael | Permalink

    a) in addition: unlike denmark, many other european countries actually DO have regulations against religious clothing and/or buildings. I think this is a violation of human rights.

  26. Posted February 25, 2010 at 8:31 pm by minna | Permalink

    @michael

    “I constantly prove their data to be wrong”

    you havent really proven anything yet. just yelled a lot.

  27. Posted February 26, 2010 at 1:32 am by michael | Permalink

    Dear Minna

    Me, my family and my countrymen are being accused of hatred towards everything that is different to us. I think it is quite decent of me to only point out the opposing facts and the inherent bigotry in this statement and not go further. So no, I am not yelling.

    In the above mentioned point A, B and C I have pointed out some of the very flawed claims. Please, feel free to explain where you think I am wrong.

    However, even if you actually proved a point there, it would still not be enough to prove Denmark as a country of bigots.

    For instance, if you are a non-western foreigner and take a Danish education (that is, an education that employers know what is), then your employment and pay statistics would be almost identical to native Danes. Would this be possible if actual widespread discrimination was present? Yes it would, but can you argument for it with facts or logic?

    Also, Danes welcome state heads of different religions at the same level as other european countries. And we are much more open minded towards state heads of different ethnic origin, sexual orientation and sex than most other europeans. Would this be possible if we where inherently racists?
    I doubt it, but still, can you give a fact or logically based reason?

    I have also read studies of Scandinavian openmindedness, that proved we where quite similar to Swedes, Norwegians and Icelanders, but unfortunately I cannot provide a link, since I have lost it.

    But do these 2 GENERAL and NON-SINGULAR facts make ANY impression on you, dear Minna?

    After no. 99^999 debated bigot, I am still naive enough to think that human stupidity isn’t infinite. Please prove me and Einstein wrong. Either by acknowledgement and reflection (unlikely) or at least by attempting to give intelligent opposing arguments.

    So please, enlighten me…

  28. Posted February 26, 2010 at 12:07 pm by minna | Permalink

    still no facts, huh? just more claims and “lost links”

  29. Posted February 27, 2010 at 2:40 am by Madsen | Permalink

    “And if you present these figures to Danes, they’ll either question the validity of the statistics or say that it’s their firm belief that it’s worse in other countries. Why? Because acknowledging the truth would mean that changes should be made. And change compromises hygge.”

    Heh…nice rhetorical trick meant to fend off opposing views in advance huh?!

  30. Posted March 4, 2010 at 2:13 am by Peter Andreas | Permalink

    @madsen: I suppose you could see it like that as well as you could see the rules of mathematical operations as a clever way to fend off opposing views on the fact that 2 plus 2 equals four.

    P.

  31. Posted March 4, 2010 at 11:17 am by Canadian | Permalink

    Madsen wrote:
    Heh…nice rhetorical trick meant to fend off opposing views in advance huh?!

    In Denmark, there are a number of deeply anchored beliefs used to put an end to any (self-)examination or debate. One of them is the idea that all Danes are one and the same, one family, one mind.

    In Etik uden moral (http://www.mtp.hum.ku.dk/details.asp?eln=202769), Ole Bjerg discusses how there is no such thing as the mythical “we” of Denmark. Recently covered by DR: http://www.dr.dk/P1/P1Formiddag/Udsendelser/2010/03/02085111.htm

    If Danes admitted that there is no “we,” it might counter the perpetuation of the “Us vs. Them” mentality, and also help the evolution of a culture of debate where issues actually do get discussed instead of being swept under the carpet, because any honest criticism is considered an attack on the whole population of native Danes (the “we,” the Danes, Danishness), and therefore dismissed with the usual ways to sabotage any real discussion:
    1) “We” are not like that./”We” don’t do that.
    2) “We” are still better than “them” (and “you”).
    3) This is the way “we” do things here. Get with the program or leave.
    4) And finally: “We” have the truth. “We” know better. “We” are the best.

    As Mr. Manky wrote (link above), if a culture has attained perfection, any evolution/change or input from the outside would be less than perfect, wouldn’t it?

  32. Posted March 4, 2010 at 8:14 pm by michael | Permalink

    @Canadian

    Very true indeed. People are individuals, not collectivistic constructions. We should see each others as human beings, but this doesn’t mean, that we shouldn’t acknowledge general tendencies and point out problematic areas. Otherwise, peter andreas would be wrong by default, not because he simply …well, is wrong.

    The tendency of “us” and “them” simplifications is not a Danish phenomonen. It is a common trait of ALL nationalities. Something you clearly also do, and something I also do (although I try to avoid it).

    Minna requested data before. I didn’t provide it because a) facts wouldn’t make her change her bigoted mind, and b) facts are HER and YOUR responsibility, not mine. After all, I’m not the one with the accusations (at least not the original ones).

    However, I find it interesting to see the creativity people use to avoid reflection. Mr. Manky is quite boring here. He let’s the conversation go on, but when he is continually proved wrong, he simply uses censorship on the comments.

    So here’s the fact sheet of a report about discrimination from the eu commission:

    http://ec.europa.eu/public_opinion/archives/ebs/ebs_317_fact_dk_en.pdf

    The results was based on questionaires.

    Some of the questions regard to how Danes PERCEIVE discrimination in their country. Here the questioned Dane has a higher tendency to acknowledge discrimination than the average european. This wouldn’t be the case for a country similar to peter andreas version.

    Other questions relates to how openminded the questioned are themselves. The general Dane would welcome both friends, acquintances and even state leaders that are different from themselves. Is this the results you would expect from a racist country?

    For the sake of efficiency I have made some pre-answers you can use to dismiss the facts:

    I am wrong because I…

    a) Question the validity of peter andreas faked facts

    b) Say it is worse in other countries by refering to an eu average.

    c) Live in happy-land where Denmark is perfect and I would NEVER admit anything else.

  33. Posted March 5, 2010 at 2:02 pm by Canadian | Permalink

    Michael:
    So, basically, you are saying that the same phenomenons exist in other countries (no argument there), but that Denmark is still better than “other places.”

    I refer to my point 2:
    “2) “We” are still better than “them” (and “you”).”

    I think I’ve seen a similar EU survey on Danish self-perception before, which had similar results. Here is another EU survey on DK’s relative success at integration:
    http://www.integrationindex.eu

    Go see the overall ranking. Self-perception does not equal facts.

  34. Posted March 5, 2010 at 9:06 pm by michael | Permalink

    Canadian:

    Interesting link. Although I do not agree that all of their “best practices” would equal better migrant immigrantion, I still welcome the use of reason and logic with open arms.

    But please, let me make something clear:

    I am not claiming that there are no problems with discrimination in Denmark. There are, and I have newer been afraid to speak my opinion when confronted by ethnic-racist opinions.

    I am also not claiming, that some of the Danish policies aren’t problematic.

    The single issue that I am addressing is Peter Andreas’ claim that Danes IN GENERAL are racists. All empirical evidence show the exact opposite.

  35. Posted March 6, 2010 at 3:30 pm by Canadian | Permalink

    The thing is, I don’t think that’s what Peter Andreas is claiming. But you made your point, not all Danes are racists.

  36. Posted March 15, 2010 at 2:58 am by agnes | Permalink

    I spent a few years in Denmark in the ’60s and don’t remember it like this at all. But is satisfaction with your life such a bad thing then!!! Pity more people don’t experience it.

  37. Posted March 23, 2010 at 12:10 pm by Canadian | Permalink

    I hope that the new health care reform is going to help your family, desertSage.

  38. Posted April 15, 2010 at 8:15 pm by Harleigh Kyson Jr. | Permalink

    For me, reading Peter Andreas’s criticisms of Denmark has been an eerie experience. They mirror my own criticisms of the United States.

    I was born in 1938 in Los Angeles, California. I grew up gay. In my formative years, the Los Angeles Police Department treated gay people with the same violence they used in dealing with blacks and Mexican Americans.

    Everything I have read up to this point has made me regret that I wasn’t born in Denmark, where I expected that I would have had a much happier life growing up gay than I have had even in California, one of our more socially and politically liberal states.

    Now my confidence has been shaken.

  39. Posted December 14, 2010 at 10:08 pm by Kim Jensen | Permalink

    Isn’t it interesting how everything good can also be viewed upon as bad if yo do it right.

    This post could just as well have ben written about Love. How many people commit suicide or murder for love. How many people seek love without ever finding it, living unhappy. People hurting others in the name of love. Yes Love is a bad thing indeed, lets fight it!! Love and Hygge

  40. Posted April 15, 2011 at 9:59 am by T | Permalink

    Wow – you are one sad and bitter man. Is this an attempt to direct attention toward your ad agency – or are you really this determined to piss all over your own country?

  41. Posted June 14, 2011 at 7:29 pm by Fabi | Permalink

    Hey Petter
    I enjoyed your blog, you give a lot information about Danish culture and also to this can improve my these from the Uni, by the way i feel sad to hear about danish people should be very more happy, I’m from Brazil you can imagine how our politics is corrupt here, but this does not mean that we are not a happy people.
    Take care of yourself and thanks you!

  42. Posted June 15, 2011 at 1:09 am by Fabi | Permalink

    Sorry, Peter!

3 Trackbacks

  1. [...] salty water and slush. I suppose it’s a cute idea, although whether or not it’s “hyggeligt” is [...]

  2. By Holy Hygge (part 2) - Downsides Of Denmark on February 23, 2010 at 3:24 am

    [...] then? How did Denmark cope with the fact that five women were mutilated in the name of Bornholmian hygge? The two doctor’s are still working at the same hospital. Their boss has commented on the [...]

  3. [...] already covered the Danes’ attitude towards change, so let’s not go deeper into that now. Let me just give you an example of the fact that when [...]

Downsides Of Denmark

Peter Andreas

43-year-old ad man. Very disappointed with his country and people.